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Post by Clare on Sept 26, 2008 9:52:45 GMT -5
5.10 Into The Woods - Episode #088
Buffy's celebrations after her mother's successful surgery are cut short when she learns that Riley has been paying vampires to bite him.
Review (also post a score out of 10) and discuss this episode.
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Post by cyclica on Feb 9, 2009 17:17:16 GMT -5
The big buffy/riley break up episode.
I used to quite like riley, at least until he started letting vampires bite him. I guess joss realised that with the initiative storyline over riley was now just a regular guy and not interesting enough to stay on the show for the rest of its run. So they had to come up with the riley-wants-attention storyline, which lead up to this episode. Which is a shame because I was rooting for their relationship much more than I was with angel or spike. Not that I found riley more interesting, but because I could see a future in the relationship, whereas buffy couldn't date a vampire forever.
Unfortunately this episode suffers from being way too emotional and dramatic, with almost nothing else. And the xanya plot wasn't great either- xander spent the whole episode barely tolerating her, then at the end, out of nowhere made a speech about how much he loves her. Pleh.
I give this episode a 3. Probably the worst episode so far.
One more thing- maybe its just me, but I always seem to have trouble remembering what this episode and the previous one are called. I keep thinking this one is called 'listening to fear', because in a way riley listens to fear and leaves, and the previous one is called 'into the woods' because the gang goes into the woods. :-\
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Post by partcynic on Aug 31, 2010 15:58:10 GMT -5
5x10 “Into the Woods”
Episode Rating = 3
At long last, we’ve been handed the overdue Buffy/Riley break-up episode, and it predictably locks step with its so-so predecessors “Goodbye, Iowa” and “Out of My Mind”. Knowing the typical quality of Buffy/Riley showcases, I wouldn’t have gone into “Into the Woods” with particularly high expectations, so I can’t say that I was in any way surprised by its middling quality. To give writer (and first-time director) Marti Noxon due credit, I felt that she did an admirable job in trying to make Buffy and Riley’s relationship three-dimensional and complex, but one episode couldn’t remedy the flaws of an entire storyline, and “Into the Woods” ends up being a dull example of how not to write an emotional show.
What I Liked about “Into the Woods”:
- It’s pleasing that Joyce came out of her surgery well, and the gang’s happy reactions are charming (I liked how Giles and Xander went for a hug; then settled for a handshake). Best of all, it now means that we’ll get a temporary break from those interminable hospital scenes.
- Dawn’s scene with Anya and Xander is entertaining, and I was amused by Anya’s keenness on watching the monkey movie.
- Despite not being interested in the story they led to, the Magic Box discussions were refreshingly light-hearted, providing moments of levity in an otherwise grim story. Giles and Willow’s jokey statements about the surplus chicken feet were funny, as were Anya’s comments about sponge-bathing Xander and her jubilant “Have a nice day! Don’t get killed!” as the gang left to investigate the brothel.
- The vampire plot works nicely as a metaphor for prostitution, and it’s comparatively daring for the show to examine such a thing. As odd as it may sound, I liked that some vampires were more pragmatic, and their set-up made logical sense (blood plus money, and no bodies). It was also neat that Giles and Anya seemed to acknowledge the practicality of the scheme, and pointed out that it was more morally ambiguous than what the Scoobs usually deal with.
- The Spike/Riley, Buffy/Riley and Xander/Buffy conversations were all excellently written, and dealt with issues that had been building for a long time. It’s a shame that there were multiple problems with acting (see my negatives section), but some of the lines were powerful, and I liked that Xander made good on his knowledge of the Buffy/Riley dynamic and tried to change Buffy’s mind.
- Xander’s mini-speech to Anya is one of his finest moments (between this and “The Replacement”, he’s now truly grown up) – I just wish that it wasn’t preceded by him treating her so badly. As a result, his attitude shift seemed like more of a character happening than a substantial development.
- In a first for the season, I really like some of the incidental music. The piece that plays as Buffy runs to Riley is gorgeous, particularly in its first half.
What I Disliked about “Into the Woods”:
- In terms of lighting, this episode is plagued by the darkness and yellow tinges that characterise much of the season. I made an effort to check who was credited as the director of photography, and it’s the same guy who did all of the great work in S1-4 – so I’m guessing that budget cuts must be responsible for this murky ugliness.
- Since “Listening to Fear” ended with Anya and Tara joining the others to support Buffy/Joyce, it might have been nice to have a line explaining why they weren’t present at the start of this episode. A brief mention of having classes/opening the Magic Box for Giles would have sufficed.
- The Willow/Anya confrontation is okay as set-up for “Triangle”, but I don’t really care about their relationship. In addition, Anya needs to stop playing the ‘newly human’ card – it’s now been two years since she lost her powers, so she should have gotten the basics of social interaction down.
- Riley ‘staking’ Spike at the close of act two was jaw-droppingly cheap, and the costume people could have at least put a hole in Spike’s shirt for the subsequent scene.
- One thing that was always going to be a strike against this episode stemmed from something beyond its control, and extends to Buffy/Riley material throughout the series. While I’ll preface this by saying that I’m no Riley-hater, the depiction of their relationship has always been a case of telling instead of showing. For all of the grand statements about their profound love and the two caring about each other like no-one before, I - to quote Riley - “just don’t feel it”. After over a year of coupledom, I’d be hard-pressed to give you non-superficial reasons as to why they care about each other, and although Buffy’s lack of genuine love is part of the point, the relationship remains hard to believe. This created major issues for “Out of My Mind”, and it’s present even more strongly here. What this episode wanted to do was force Buffy to re-examine her flaws and realise that their issues weren’t entirely Riley’s fault (and let’s face it – his claims are founded, as she’s often treated him more like an “I can have a normal life!” trophy than a person) – but it instead made Riley look like an unfeeling twit, and Buffy a stone-hearted lemon-sucker. Knowing that Marti Noxon has stated how much she liked Riley and how sad she was to see him go, I can’t see those presentations being her intended outcome, and can only assume that the story failed.
- In terms of plot construction, it was stupid beyond belief to have Riley go on his vamp excursions as Buffy was dealing with Joyce’s illness, as there’s no way he could have been sympathetic in doing so. As I said in my other point, I actually get where Riley’s coming from, but I was still applauding Buffy when she tore into him for betraying her while she was going through something so traumatic.
- I don’t have anything against Marc Blucas, but he’s always been a limited actor, and he lacks the depth necessary to carry truly emotional scenes. Sequences like Riley’s training-room chat with Buffy should have been powerful insights in the character’s psyche, but the acting rendered them flat and stilted.
- I wasn’t a fan of the macho, military-themed chats in S4, and I’m not that keen on them here. Is there a never-ending repository of generic, personality-free yet ‘rugged’ actors for these roles? Can’t at least one of them bring some charisma to their part?
- I’m ambivalent about Buffy’s decision to stake the prostitute. Yes, she’s a vampire, but Buffy’s choice was made solely out of spite. At the end of the day, it’s not the girl’s fault that Riley betrayed Buffy, and letting her think she was going to live before killing her was plain nasty.
- Buffy’s change of heart at the end is unbelievable, and seems to happen only for plot purposes. As with many other things, it might have worked had we been given real evidence of her feelings for Riley.
- The editing in the ‘run to Riley’ sequence is sloppy. The transitions feel clumsy, and don’t create feelings of urgency.
Do I like this episode more or less than the last time I watched it?
I feel the same. I can sympathise with the difficulty of producing a satisfying conclusion to an oft-criticised storyline, yet it remains that “Into the Woods” makes the cardinal error of reaching for emotion where there is none. These flaws are more due to the enduring problems with the Buffy/Riley arc than anything new, but at the end of the day, issues are issues regardless of the episode’s individual responsibility. Still, there’s some smart dialogue and insightful conversations to be found, and the crime here is tediousness as opposed to bad writing. Consequently, I’ll award “Into the Woods” a three out of ten, and concede that it at least fits with S5’s newfound style.
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Post by cyclica on Oct 26, 2010 16:23:52 GMT -5
- Dawn’s scene with Anya and Xander is entertaining, and I was amused by Anya’s keenness on watching the monkey movie. ...Despite not being interested in the story they led to, the Magic Box discussions were refreshingly light-hearted, providing moments of levity in an otherwise grim story. Giles and Willow’s jokey statements about the surplus chicken feet were funny, as were Anya’s comments about sponge-bathing Xander and her jubilant “Have a nice day! Don’t get killed!” as the gang left to investigate the brothel. Agreed. It's scenes like these that cement season 5 as 'The anya year', the season of the show where she was at her best. - The vampire plot works nicely as a metaphor for prostitution, and it’s comparatively daring for the show to examine such a thing. As odd as it may sound, I liked that some vampires were more pragmatic, and their set-up made logical sense (blood plus money, and no bodies). It was also neat that Giles and Anya seemed to acknowledge the practicality of the scheme, and pointed out that it was more morally ambiguous than what the Scoobs usually deal with. I like it when anya is providing exposition. She's over a thousand years old and presumably has more knowledge and experience of demons than all the scoobies put together, including spike, especially given how her lack of human social skills would imply she spent all that time exclusively in the company of other demons. With that in mind, it's surprising how little her knowlegde comes up in the show, and any little reference now and then that she's a demon expert and not just some crazy lady is appreciated. - Xander’s mini-speech to Anya is one of his finest moments (between this and “The Replacement”, he’s now truly grown up) – I just wish that it wasn’t preceded by him treating her so badly. As a result, his attitude shift seemed like more of a character happening than a substantial development. Agreed. - Since “Listening to Fear” ended with Anya and Tara joining the others to support Buffy/Joyce, it might have been nice to have a line explaining why they weren’t present at the start of this episode. A brief mention of having classes/opening the Magic Box for Giles would have sufficed. The writers have a frustrating tendancy to continue to treat anya and tara as 'additional members' of the core group of B,W,X & G. Anya is a main character, she's been on the show for over 2 years by this point, I don't get why she's so often left out without explanation. At least it's not as bad as in s7, when she sometimes just doesn't appear in an episode at all. - One thing that was always going to be a strike against this episode stemmed from something beyond its control, and extends to Buffy/Riley material throughout the series. While I’ll preface this by saying that I’m no Riley-hater, the depiction of their relationship has always been a case of telling instead of showing. For all of the grand statements about their profound love and the two caring about each other like no-one before, I - to quote Riley - “just don’t feel it”. After over a year of coupledom, I’d be hard-pressed to give you non-superficial reasons as to why they care about each other, and although Buffy’s lack of genuine love is part of the point, the relationship remains hard to believe. This created major issues for “Out of My Mind”, and it’s present even more strongly here. What this episode wanted to do was force Buffy to re-examine her flaws and realise that their issues weren’t entirely Riley’s fault (and let’s face it – his claims are founded, as she’s often treated him more like an “I can have a normal life!” trophy than a person) – but it instead made Riley look like an unfeeling twit, and Buffy a stone-hearted lemon-sucker. Knowing that Marti Noxon has stated how much she liked Riley and how sad she was to see him go, I can’t see those presentations being her intended outcome, and can only assume that the story failed. Yep. And even if the relationship was better written, and Marc Blucas's acting was better, I probably still wouldn't have liked the break-up scenes. I hope the reason they broke up was that the actor wanted to leave, because if it was just a case of having a dramatic twist in the story, then it was a stupid idea. I for one derive no pleasure or entertainment from watching couples break up. ..... I stand by my 3 rating. And the award for the worst line in the episode goes to... Xander. "It was right in front of my Xander face" Btw partcynic, are you reading my (older) reviews? It's just that you never comment on them. |
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Post by partcynic on Nov 2, 2010 9:42:57 GMT -5
I'd never thought about it that way, but you're right. Anya was very enjoyable this season, and struck a good balance between her relationship material with Xander and other stuff in the Magic Box. I really wish she could've been permitted to stand on her own more in the last two seasons.
Agreed. The writers should have used her rich and varied history for more than just cheap jokes.
Absolutely. It makes me nostalgic for the high school days, when Cordelia could be portrayed as both Xander's girlfriend and an individual character in her own right. Oz also had a life and a social circle away from the Scoobs. Poor Anya and Tara weren't even granted that.
Riley was written out because the writers realised there was no mileage remaining for the character. It really should have happened at the end of S4, but I'm glad they finally realised that he had little left to contribute, and had lost most of what made him likeable when he first appeared.
Which reviews are you referring to?
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Post by cyclica on Nov 2, 2010 18:58:16 GMT -5
Which reviews are you referring to? The 2008/2009 reviews that are above yours. In my newer reviews/comments I often leave out anything I've already written, because I don't want to make the same points twice. |
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Post by partcynic on Nov 3, 2010 18:07:41 GMT -5
^ I'll make sure I check those too, for all of the subsequent eps.
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